Hey Scott,
Curious about the Vader/Simmons title switch in 1992. WCW/NWA always had long heel runs as chance, or at least normally. The face runs seemed to be pretty short. So why the Vader/Ron Simmons switch? Vader had just destroyed Sting not even a month prior and was a huge monster. In less than a month, Ron Simmons wins giving us him vs. Barbarian at Halloween Havoc? Doesn't make any sense. My only guess was either a: Vader's Japan schedule, or b: Watts was so sick of the racist talk that Simmons was given the strap as political play (not saying Simmons didn't deserve a run, the pop was pretty big after he won the belt).
He was trying to recreate the magic of the Junkyard Dog from 10 years before in Mid-South, where the black champion turned the territory around. Needless to say, Ron Simmons did not have the charisma that JYD did. Plus, as you noted, Watts was trying to show how not racist he was. As with most things in Bill's reign in WCW, the whole deal didn't go very well for him.
Simmons vs Barbarian was a hell of a power match. Two underrated guys I liked seeing on top however brief.
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of Havoc 92, worst triple main event of all time? Rude/Chono, Barbarian/Simmons, Sting/Roberts.
ReplyDeleteI can't think of another show that would top that
I never liked Simmons as a kid. Not because he was a bad wrestler or anything (he was perfectly fine), but that jheri curl & headband look was 10 years behind the times even in 1992.
ReplyDeleteRacist!
ReplyDeleteI never liked Simmons much either, for me I didn't notice his lack of charisma but more of his mobility (or lack off) in the ring. I know he's a former football player, but the guy didn't move like an athlete.
ReplyDeletei don't know if I have ever seen that match. But i think part of the complaint was that nobody was buying the Barbarian as a legit contender...
ReplyDeleteOh I agree nobody was but its a fun match.
ReplyDeleteIts not like WCW had much talent depth. And we've been dealt worse by WWE like Great Khali as world champion.
He was a nose guard at FSU. It'd make sense for him to not really move like an athlete.
ReplyDeleteHe definitely didn't have the charisma of JYD, but that pop when he won the title was something WCW only got out of its fans once or twice a year (Steamboat's return in '91, Flair beating Vader in '93). I think the major reason Simmons did work well was because no one was buying The Barbarian as a legitimate title threat (and really not even Cactus Jack yet, his falls count anywhere match with Sting a couple months earlier notwithstanding). They would have been better off having Simmons win the rematch with Vader at Havoc, or even the Clash that preceded it, and wait until after Starrcade to put it back on Vader. Simmons would have been more established as a continued top tier guy going forward. Instead, after coming back from injury he never got close to the same pop in WCW, and got relegated to a failed TV Title feud, then a failed heel turn against Ice Train.
ReplyDeleteI want to say that Vader was injured but that may not be accurate. Simmons biggest problem was getting someone of name to job to him. Look at the title win, Vader jumped right back up after the 3 count. It was always doomed to fail.
ReplyDeleteI'm pretty sure it wasn't due to a Vader injury. You could see them telegraphing the title switch when Vader beat Sting at the Bash. Simmons was there and then went to check on Sting after the pin.
ReplyDeleteThey were trying to do the Bret Hart 'Fighting Champion' thing where he was defending the title all the time on Worldwide & Saturday Night & stuff, but they were putting him in with scrubs like Tony Atlas & Tracy Smothers. Not really a recipe for nuclear heat.
ReplyDeleteI distinctly remember the handicap match where he teamed with 2 Cold. Simmons was the champ but the match was setup to put all the heat on Scorpio. That would have been a great time to turn heel, especially seeing the face run wasn't setting the world on fire.
ReplyDeleteWas Ron Simmons a standout performer in Doom? I remember the team being fairly balanced, but after the tag-team break-up blow off, Butch Reed dropped into obscurity (outside of his brief affiliation with Barbarian and Cactus Jack). I know his name is never mentioned in 'most underrated' discussions, but I'm curious what the perception of Reed was back then. Did everyone know he was going to be the Marty Jannetty of the team*?
ReplyDelete*Please not I use the term 'Marty Jannetty' colloquially to mean 'lower achieving partner following a split' with full recognition that Mary Jannetty actually had the talent and opportunity to become a greater success but failed largely due to poor decision making skills.
Damn!
ReplyDeleteSomebody had to say it :)
Yah I remember that. It just felt completely random. But EVERYTHING early 90's WCW felt random an endless "Battle Bowl". Who had title reigns, factions, tag teams, anything. I actually kind of dug it though, had that real life feel of "anybody can win"......like, Ron Simmons defending against Barbarian.
ReplyDeleteVader went on to wrestle anyways the very same card (Havoc 92) against Nikita Koloff, so he was able to perform atleast
ReplyDeleteTo me, it was all about Watts trying to turn back the clock to the Mid-South days with JYD and Bill always had a fascination for former college football and pro-football stars (Dr. Death, Ernie Ladd, etc.)
ReplyDeleteAll things aside, it was a pretty awesome moment when Simmons won the title.
ReplyDeletePlaying hot potato with the WCW title at that point was silly though -- when you have Vader WHHHHHYYY on earth would you make *HIM* of all people your transitional champion? I get that he spent a lot of time in Japan, but he was on a full-time WCW schedule at that point.
Business was tanking period at that point for both the WWF and WCW though, so I suppose they were trying to stumble onto something with the title switch.
Well Rick Rude was scheduled to challenge Simmons at Starrcade, but got injured. I think Rude should have been Ron's main challenger as soon as he won the belt, and Rude should've had a reign. C'est la vie.
ReplyDeleteI always thought that Simmons was considered the better wrestler, but I think he was also a lot younger (although I could be wrong on the "a lot" part) and that might have had something to do with it.
ReplyDeleteHowever all three were pretty good matches, regardless of the stupid Sting/Jake stip. WCW early 90's was so much more fun the WWF at that point. Dangerous Alliance, Koloff, Sting, Dustin, Steiners, etc. I still remember Jake's WCW debut, they aired a whole hour show about it. WCW Power Hour with Teddy Long and Missy Hyatt!!!
ReplyDelete